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My try at Spaten dark (Optimator)

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1 Can Octoberfest Vienna Lager HME
1 Can Creamy Brown UME
1# LIGHT MUNICH MALT DME (2# for More malt and darker color still debating on this)
1 Packet Munich Lager - 2308 Wyeast Pitchable Yeast
1oz CASCADE Pellet Hops(devide in two, half cooked and half in keg dry)
2 Muslin Hop Sack
1/2 Teaspoon fresh nutmeg
1/4 Cup Dark Brown Sugar
1 Packet One-Step™ Sanitizing Cleanser


What do you think??

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Looks good to me. Isn't the only adjunct the 1/4# dark brown sugar? Not much at all considering all the malt in the recipe.

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Maybe not cascades?

Correct me if Im wrong, but I associate those with more American pales etc and not a German bock. To be more true to the German-ness maybe go hallertau or tettnanger? Doesn't really matter cause I assume you are just using for bitterness boil.

Just my two cents.

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The Dude wrote:

Maybe not cascades?

Correct me if Im wrong, but I associate those with more American pales etc and not a German bock. To be more true to the German-ness maybe go hallertau or tettnanger? Doesn't really matter cause I assume you are just using for bitterness boil.

Just my two cents.

Thanks

Still new and not sure of the true flavor profiles of all the hops. I found searching for a recipe no real good clone for but many lighter off shoots and using cascade was listed in some so that is why I picked them.

I asked here since I know the BORG knows the hop profiles better and may give some knowledge up that will help.

I was thinking that 1/4 cup was enough DBS since much denser and molasses flavor. Do you think is enough or should Adjunct be more 1/3 cup?

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The Optimator is a Dopplebock. I would use 2 lbs of the DME and switch to using hallertau hops. I would go really light on the hops though even 1/4 oz of traditional hallertau at 20 min boil pushes your IBUs to the highest allowable for style. It is your beer though and if you think it will taste better with more hops go for it. As for the brown sugar any is too much for a true bock because it goes against the German law that I can't properly spell so I won't try, however I put a full cup(.5 lbs) of brown sugar in mine. I can't a test to how it tastes yet as it is still in the secondary. If you want to go up to 1/3 cup you will still have a really good malt to adjunct ratio.

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Tanarri wrote:

The Optimator is a Dopplebock. I would use 2 lbs of the DME and switch to using hallertau hops. I would go really light on the hops though even 1/4 oz of traditional hallertau at 20 min boil pushes your IBUs to the highest allowable for style. It is your beer though and if you think it will taste better with more hops go for it. As for the brown sugar any is too much for a true bock because it goes against the German law that I can't properly spell so I won't try, however I put a full cup(.5 lbs) of brown sugar in mine. I can't a test to how it tastes yet as it is still in the secondary. If you want to go up to 1/3 cup you will still have a really good malt to adjunct ratio.

Reinheitsgebot! That's the word! Lol

As far as the 2# dme that's a pretty solid idea to keep it concurrent to the aforementioned purity law, but if you do that you probably don't need the brown sugar I'd say. So just pick between the two. If you could care less about perfect to style beers (none of mine have been yet) then I say go for it! You'll have a good brew if you give it time, though it may not be perfect to style guidelines.

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Tanarri wrote:

The Optimator is a Dopplebock. I would use 2 lbs of the DME and switch to using hallertau hops. I would go really light on the hops though even 1/4 oz of traditional hallertau at 20 min boil pushes your IBUs to the highest allowable for style. It is your beer though and if you think it will taste better with more hops go for it. As for the brown sugar any is too much for a true bock because it goes against the German law that I can't properly spell so I won't try, however I put a full cup(.5 lbs) of brown sugar in mine. I can't a test to how it tastes yet as it is still in the secondary. If you want to go up to 1/3 cup you will still have a really good malt to adjunct ratio.

You have to let me know how it works out, but I would guess this will need 8 weeks condition atleast.

I was thinking that a long boil for bitterness and the dry would add aroma and some flavor, what about 1/4oz for 30 min and 1/4oz 20 min for flavor?

I like a little hopness too it, not clone really but close

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Very interesting recipe. Please keep us up to date on this one. Optimator is one of my favorites. Its a big beer but not to big.
And I too have been looking for a good clone recipe for it.

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Using qBrew and notes from here, I redid the recipe.

DoppelBock characteristics:
OG Min 1.072--------IBU Min 16---------Color Min 6*
OG Max 1.096-------IBU Max 26--------Color Max 25*


Spaten Dark Clone(Optimator) #1
-------------------------------
Brewer: Trollby
Style: Doppelbock
Batch: 2.25 gal (Extract)

Characteristics
---------------
Recipe Gravity: 1.087 OG
Recipe Bitterness: 26 IBU
Recipe Color: 25° SRM
Estimated FG: 1.022
Alcohol by Volume: 8.5%
Alcohol by Weight: 6.6%

Ingredients
-----------
Briess LME - Traditional Dark 3.30 lb, Extract, Extract
Brown Sugar, Light 0.75 lb, Sugar, Other
MrB. Octoberfest Vienna Lager 1.21 lb, Extract, Extract

Hallertauer (Germany) 0.25 oz, Pellet, 0 minutes
Hallertauer (Germany) 0.75 oz, Pellet, 20 minutes
MrB. Octoberfest Vienna Lager 1.21 oz, Pellet, 5 minutes

Mr. Beer Liquid Ale Yeast 1.00 unit, Yeast, Flocculation – low to medium; apparent attenuation 73-77% between 60-72° F
1/2 Teaspoon fresh nutmeg

Notes
-----
Recipe Notes:
Mr. Beer Liquid Yeast is Wyeast American Ale ABV 11% tolerant

Add 1 gallon of filtered tap water, LME, Brown Sugar. then add additional water until reach 2 gallons + 2 cups of liquid. (approx 2.13 gallons, HME addition will make 2.25 gallons liquid)
Bring to a boil add Hallertauer (3/4) hops and boil for 20 min.
Remove from heat, stir in HME and Nutmeg, mix well, now place in ICE bath until temp is below 70* F.
Pour cooled WORT into fermentor, add remaining Hallertaur hops, aerate well and take OG sample then pitch yeast.


Batch Notes:
This recipe is a full boil and cool of WORT, if you do not want to do full boil reduce water in boil by 1 gallon water and add cold water to Keg prior to adding WORT.

Activate the liquid yeast around 3-4 hours PRIOR to your pitch time
Sanitize all equipment including hop-sacks and liquid yeast package.
Ferment beer 21 days at 64 - 66* F
Conditioning beer 3-4 months

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Looks like you went way up on the brown sugar. Tanarri said a cup is half a pound and you're at 3/4 lb. So, a cup and a half. Considering you were debating 0.25 cup vs. 0.33 cup, going to 1.5 sounds like a big change!

Still sounds like a good recipe, in general. I'm a hops guy, so hopping up any style of brew sounds good to me. Keep us posted on the results. I may have to add something like this to my to-do list!

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Yes I also added 3.3 # of LME and dropped the UME

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Hi, how did this turn out. And where do you get the Munich Malt DME. Is the yeast available from Mr. Beer. Do not see anything in the store with "Munich" in it. Would love to try this but it looks as though you guys do it differently than Mr. Beer instructions.

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Gazzer wrote:

Hi, how did this turn out. And where do you get the Munich Malt DME. Is the yeast available from Mr. Beer. Do not see anything in the store with "Munich" in it. Would love to try this but it looks as though you guys do it differently than Mr. Beer instructions.

I have not made this yet.
I get my non-mr. beer stuff at a LHBS and the carry Munich DME in stock, along with many steeping grains to make any brew you want.

I plan on doing this when the weather cools down so easier to lager

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FWIW, I'm absolutly certain there isn't any nutmeg in the real thing.

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