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Zebediah

Amarillo Amber Ale recipe feedback (DME)

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Now that my pilsener is in the keg, it's time to start planning my next batch. I'm thinking of doing an amber ale w/ amarillo hops. My goal is a balanced to slightly hoppy beer, where the hops accentuate the flavor but don't overpower. I'm thinking I want around 5.0% ABV, but it's okay to over or under shoot.

Here's what I have available for use:
1 oz Amarillo hops pellets
3 lbs Briess Sparkling Amber DME
3 lbs Briess Dark DME
1 lb Briess Carapils, crushed

I've never steeped grain before, so this will be my first attempt.

Here's the recipe I was thinking - feedback much appreciated:
Recipe: Amarillo Amber Ale
Batch 2.40 gal
0.25 lb Briess Carapils, crushed, steeped 30 minutes at 152 degrees
2.00 lb Briess DME - Sparkling Amber Extract Extract
1.00 lb Briess DME - Traditional Dark Extract Extract
0.30 oz Amarillo 60 minutes
0.30 oz Amarillo 20 minutes
0.40 oz Amarillo 5 minutes

Estimated OG: 1.055 FG: 1.014 IBU: 33 SRM: 13 ABV: 5.3%

Whaddya think?

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Yankeedag has a good point. You probably want more aroma and flavor from the hops more than you want bitterness. 50/30/20 would probably have more hop taste less bite. I personally think you should just bump the amount of hops up a tad and do two boil times of 40 and 10. That'll give ya enough bitterness, nice hoppy taste and aroma.

The steep sounds good. Maybe bump the temp up to 155-160 to get more or those unfermebtable sugars out of them. This will compliment the DME, add a little sweetness and give great head retention.

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I only have 1 oz of Amarillo on hand right now, but I can always get more if need be.

If I understand correctly, given 1 oz, you're both recommending:
0.5 oz for 60 minutes
0.3 oz for 20 minutes
0.2 oz for 5 minutes

QBrew calculates this to be 45 IBU, which it tells me is out of range for an Amber Ale (25-40). I'm okay deviating, just want to make sure I'm understanding you.

EDIT: I am not totally sure if my palate understands the difference between hops bitterness and hops flavor, but I was thinking this brew would be balanced or just slightly hoppy.

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50/30/20 was for boil times. 50 minutes, 30 minutes, 20 minutes.

I said 40 minutes then 10 minutes with the ounce split .5oz each boil to achieve a nice bitterness (probably between 25-30 IBU's but I don't have my Beersmith handy).

Bitterness comes out more in longer boils and the flavor and aroma from hops are achieved from shorter boil times with larger hop additions. Thus, giving you the tasty "hoppiness" without the big "bite" (strong bitterness) that you get from longer boils. I typically do 60/20/5 for standard boils but I like getting creative.

I'm going to be brewing a session amber ale with nugget and Amarillo hops. I'm doing 40/20/5 with larger hop additions and less boil time to get that hoppy taste and aroma with not all that huge bite. Cuz amber ales should still have a good malt flavor.

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bigd wrote:

Cuz amber ales should still have a good malt flavor.


I definitely don't want to overpower the malt flavor. Taking that into consideration, would you guys still recommend using a full 1.0 oz of hops?

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Personally, for what you are trying to achieve, I'd go with your original hop schedule. Maybe split the flavor and aroma hops in half, but that's your call. Was this a QBrew derived recipe? I'm surprised that it's not darker with a pound of the dark DME.

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Use a whole ounce and do late hop additions. I wouldn't go higher than 45 minutes for your bittering boil. I'd personally (just my opinion) do either 45 min and 10 min or 40 min and 10 min. It'd be more aromatic and flavor from hops than bitter. It would let the malt come through good too without being malty. It'd be pretty balanced with a toughly hoppiness.

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oly wrote:

Was this a QBrew derived recipe? I'm surprised that it's not darker with a pound of the dark DME.

Yes, I was surprised that QBrew came up with an SRM of 13. I double-checked that the values/volumes were correct in QBrew. Sparkling Amber is 10* and Traditional Dark is 30*.

When I use http://www.brewersfriend.com/srm-calculator/, I get an SRM of 21, but I can't see the SRM values behind those ingredients.

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yankeedag wrote:

I think I'd go .50/.30/.20 with the hops.

Given that there is a decimal point showing and they equal 1.0 I think he is suggesting oz's of hops to use not boil times but if that is so, that would be a bit high. YD?

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mnstarzz13 wrote:

yankeedag wrote:

I think I'd go .50/.30/.20 with the hops.

Given that there is a decimal point showing and they equal 1.0 I think he is suggesting oz's of hops to use not boil times but if that is so, that would be a bit high. YD?

It is 1oz divvied up for three different time boils. 50%for bittereing 30%for flavoring and 20%for the aroma...it's still one ounce

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I'd do 0.5 oz. for 45 minutes, 0.3 oz. for 30 minutes, and 0.2 oz. for 7 minutes, if you wanted to keep it at just one ounce total.

But if, as you said, you can get more hops, I'd do 0.5 oz. for 45 minutes, 0.5 oz. for 30 minutes, and 0.25 oz. for 7 minutes.

You have a strong malt bill, so I think it'll stand up to that much hops, given the boil times, and the flavor and aroma boils will be strong, while the bitterness boil won't be too overpowering.

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mnstarzz13 wrote:

yankeedag wrote:

I think I'd go .50/.30/.20 with the hops.

Given that there is a decimal point showing and they equal 1.0 I think he is suggesting oz's of hops to use not boil times but if that is so, that would be a bit high. YD?


Just realized the decimal points lol. Oops, my mistake. I still think larger late hop additions would be best IMO. A whole ounce used in that fashion would be good. You could even dry hop if you wanted. Again, just my two cents. Whatever you do I'm sure the beer will turn out good.

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ever eat that big steak at the road house in Amarillo on 40/66...or is the name of those hops something else???

well for the record I did back in the day...somehow the names we use should reflect the places they come from...

Amarillo is a beautiful Cow Town...and I have no idea why a Hops variety is named after it...LOL...

you guys and all your numbers...does it taste good??t :side:

hope your brew works out OK...I am not certified on all the ciphering... :S

please dont take me seriously...just playin' around...in between watchin Larry the cable guy...

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You guys seem to know your brewing, so I'm going to go w/ your hops recommendations. My only concern is that, according to this chart, that puts me at the far edge of "Extra Hoppy".
[img size=300x412]http://www.brewsupplies.com/_borders/hopsgraph.jpg

A bit of a compromise based on the recommendations in this thread, but something like this will put me at 44 IBU, and should be a nice drinkable beer.

.5 oz for 50 minutes
.3 oz for 30 minutes
.2 oz for 7 minutes

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I just plugged in your original formula and I don't even come close to what you say you'll have...

I come up with OG:56 FG:15 SRM:10 IBU:35.5 BU:GU0.63 ABV:5.5% cal per 12oz at 185... all this tosses you into the slightly hoppy range.

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yankeedag wrote:

what AA rateing do you have for your hops?

QBrew originally had 8.6% for Amarillo, but my hops package says 7.5% so I just adjusted accordingly. Now QBrew calculates 40 IBU.

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I'm not sure how we're all coming up with different numbers, but I get an OG of 1.058 and 42 IBUs. And 13 SRM.

I don't have Briess carapils in my database, so I just used Carapils.

Just to make sure we're on the same page, this is:
2.4 gallons
2 lbs Briess Sparkling Amber DME
1 lb Briess Traditional Dark DME
.25 lbs carapils (steeped)

7.5% AA hops
.5 oz 50 minutes
.3 oz 30 minutes
.2 oz 7 minutes

I'm set at 50% for steeping and tinseth is unchecked.

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I get the same as you BP in Qbrew. It appear YD may be using beersmith since he posted calories? If you want it on the malty side, I'd think 25 or less on the IBU's

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bpgreen wrote:

I'm not sure how we're all coming up with different numbers

Now that I've updated my AA, I'm getting the same as you for everything except OG, where I get 1.055. The carapils isn't changing my OG at all, not sure if it's supposed to.

At this point we're all in the same neighborhood, so I'm sure it's close enough.

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OG with CaraPils is 58...w/o is 56 for me.....wierd

for comparisons sake here is what I had entered untitled-20110316.JPG

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mnstarzz13 wrote:

for comparisons sake here is what I had entered

Okay, I know why I'm getting a lower OG. I had 1.043 instead of 1.045 for both DMEs.

On the Northern Brewer site, where I bought my DME, it says 1.043, not 1.045. However, if I look at the Briess site, and do some calculations, it says 1.045.

If I update to 1.045 on each DME, I get 1.058 recipe OG.

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Ok, related question - what kind of yeast would be good for this amber ale?

On hand I have Wyeast Kolsch 2565 (prefers temps 56-64), White Labs German Lager Yeast WLP830 (prefers temps 50-55), and then Frumunda. My LHBS has a pretty limited supply, so any other yeast would need to be mail ordered.

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Zebediah wrote:

Ok, related question - what kind of yeast would be good for this amber ale?

On hand I have Wyeast Kolsch 2565 (prefers temps 56-64), White Labs German Lager Yeast WLP830 (prefers temps 50-55), and then Frumunda. My LHBS has a pretty limited supply, so any other yeast would need to be mail ordered.

If you're going for an ale, I'd use the fromunda. If possible, use 3 packets.

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As we speak I'm harvesting the yeast from a few bottles of Bell's Best Brown Ale, thought I could give that yeast a try. Wish me luck :)

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Zebediah wrote:

As we speak I'm harvesting the yeast from a few bottles of Bell's Best Brown Ale, thought I could give that yeast a try. Wish me luck :)

That's probably a good choice. Maybe a little more work, but it may well be worth it.

Good luck!

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Brewed it up today... undershot the OG a bit. Ended up w/ 1.053 instead of the projected 1.058.

Pitched the yeast I harvested from Bell's Best Brown Ale... this one should be good.

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After fermenting for 15 days at 68F, the gravity measures 1.010. I drank the tester sample, it's very good, but maybe just a touch more hoppy than I was shooting for. I'll probably bottle it tomorrow, since I'm leaving town Wednesday for several days.

I've never used Amarillo hops, but I swear this beer has a bit of strawberry flavor and after taste, even though I used no fruit. I'm really looking forward to tasting this after 4-6 weeks in a bottle.

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Ryno344 wrote:

Curious how this turned out. Update please!

This turned out to be a very nice beer. I'm not very good at describing beer characteristics, but here it goes. The beer has enough bitterness to give a little mouth bite, similar in bitterness magnitude to Sam Adams Boston Lager, but it's far from overpowering. The color turned out a bit darker than the typical amber ale, closer to a brown ale. Not very much head retention or lacing, but I also went fairly light on the CO2.

Everyone that has tried this has said to me "Wow, you made this? It's really good!" so I'll probably revisit it without too many changes.

EDIT: I just wish I had kept track of the amount of sugar used in batch priming so I could duplicate. Not too much, not too little.

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