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Michael Astfalk

Boil Times for LME/Wort?

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I noticed on the recipes and directions that it just says to bring to a boil and remove from the heat.

 

In one of the books that I've picked up on home brewing, the author talks about boiling the LME/Wort for about 45 minutes. 

 

Is there a certain boil time that is recommended for the Mr Beer recipes?

 

Michael

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Long boils are for the bittering hops, I'll post a chart below so you'll see what I mean. For MrB no boil is needed, unless you want to do a flavor/aroma addition. Just remember do not boil the HME(can)

 

post-59190-0-81842600-1424443513_thumb.j

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Long boils are for the bittering hops, I'll post a chart below so you'll see what I mean. For MrB no boil is needed, unless you want to do a flavor/aroma addition. Just remember do not boil the HME(can)

 

attachicon.gifhop_utilization.jpg

 

Right on Jim.  Boiling our malt from our cans will diminish the hop character while boiling our LME or DME products would be acceptable.  Talking to our brewmaster or the awesome guys and gals here will help you through that process.

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So just making aure i understand. Buy am lme boil my hops in that then add that to wort at flame out?

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Boiling extracts is completely unnecessary.

 

Unless... you are trying to add hops that aren't flameout.  That's what your typical MrB recipe tells you to do: bring to boil, add hops, remove from heat.

 

Everything that Jim said is spot on.

 

The boiling times is the time the hops are in the boil and not the LME.  If you google any all-grain (AG) recipes, you will see boil times of 60/20/5 for different hop types boiling at different times for a particular flavor profile.

 

Until you have read waaaaaaaay more, I wouldn't even mess with it.  There's so many recipes on MrB, I wouldn't mess with this stuff yet.

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My next attempt is going to be the Ole Mole Stout. It is basically the Irish Stout with cocoa and brown sugar added. Directions say:

  • Remove the yeast packet from under the lid of the can of hopped malt extract (HME), then place the unopened can in hot tap water. a
  • Using the sanitized measuring cup, pour 4 cups of water into your clean 3-quart or larger pot. Bring water to a boil, and then remove from heat. Add the cayenne powder, cocoa powder and dark brown sugar, stir to mix well and cover for 5 minutes. 
  • After 5 minutes, open the can of HMEb and pour it into the hot mixture. Stir until thoroughly mixed. This mixture of unfermented beer is called wort.

So no boiling of the HME or added ingredients, just the water?

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So just making aure i understand. Buy am lme boil my hops in that then add that to wort at flame out?

Boil water, remove from heat

Add LME, stir really well, bring back to boil

Add hops and continue to boil for whatever set time you want

Remove from heat, add HME

Stir, pour into fermenter

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Michael Astfalk, on 20 Feb 2015 - 10:46 AM, said:

 

My next attempt is going to be the Ole Mole Stout. It is basically the Irish Stout with cocoa and brown sugar added. Directions say:

  • Remove the yeast packet from under the lid of the can of hopped malt extract (HME), then place the unopened can in hot tap water. a
  • Using the sanitized measuring cup, pour 4 cups of water into your clean 3-quart or larger pot. Bring water to a boil, and then remove from heat. Add the cayenne powder, cocoa powder and dark brown sugar, stir to mix well and cover for 5 minutes. 
  • After 5 minutes, open the can of HMEb and pour it into the hot mixture. Stir until thoroughly mixed. This mixture of unfermented beer is called wort.

So no boiling of the HME or added ingredients, just the water?

 

Right

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Boiling extracts is completely unnecessary.

 

Unless... you are trying to add hops that aren't flameout.  That's what your typical MrB recipe tells you to do: bring to boil, add hops, remove from heat.

 

Everything that Jim said is spot on.

 

The boiling times is the time the hops are in the boil and not the LME.  If you google any all-grain (AG) recipes, you will see boil times of 60/20/5 for different hop types boiling at different times for a particular flavor profile.

 

Until you have read waaaaaaaay more, I wouldn't even mess with it.  There's so many recipes on MrB, I wouldn't mess with this stuff yet.

With this exception: If you buy bulk LME(bring your own container and they fill it) at your LHBS, it needs to be boiled 5 or 10 min. (personally, I use 5 min )

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So no boiling of the HME or added ingredients, just the water?

 

 

HME is never boiled.  LME or DME is boiled.  If you boil HME, which is what's in the Mr. Beer cans, you change the profile.  So if they put a hop in at 30 minutes, and you boil for 10 minutes, you now have a 40 minute hop boil, when they intended 30.  

 

Never boil HMEs.

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I believe in the first chapter or two of Charlie Papazian's book he says something about kits (refering to kits like Mr Beer) will greatly benefit from a 45-60 minute boil of the HME.  This may be where the OP's question came from. 

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"Kits" usually refers to kits of steeped grains, LME or DME, and hops.  Not a can of HME.  

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From pg 24 of Charlie Papazian's The Complete Joy of Home Brewing, 4th ed.

 

"Many beer kits do not instruct the homebrewer to boil their ingredients: however, your beer will always be much better if your ingredients are boiled for at least 45 minutes.  So open your can of hop flavored malt extract and add it to a pot of water.  Stir to dissolve all of the ingredients and bring to a boil for 60 minutes."

 

I am not advocating boiling HME, merely stating that some books considered a good read for new brewers sometimes contain conflicting data and that may attribute to some confusion to new brewers about what kinds of malt extracts are meant to be boiled and what their purpose for boiling is.

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I'm starting a batch based on the Grand Bohemian Czech Pilsner HME.

 

I will be steeping some caramel malt and using DME, as well as a late addition (15 min) of Riwaka hops. My standard procedure in this kind of situation has been to steep the grains, add the DME, bring to a boil and then add the hops. I then boil the wort for as long as necessary for the desired effect ( aroma in this case) and then add the HME.

 

I'm wondering if the brew would benefit in any way from a longer boil before the hops addition or if I'm okay with the way I'm doing it. 

 

Any ideas? 

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The only benefit to boiling before the hop addition is to darken the brew.  

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15 min is a flavor addition. It will work better if you also do an aroma at like 5min. Most your sense of taste, is smell. Go back and check that chart, your cheating yourself at 15.  The hops don't reach full flavor utilization till 20+.  FWIW I would only use half at 20 and half at 5 - 7min. There is nothing to be gained by boiling longer than the hop additions, unless you just want a darker ale.

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HMEs - Hopped Malt Extracts - already have the hop profile boiled into them for the particular style of beer they are trying to become.  If you boil them again you will change that profile and your Octoberfest will no longer be an Octoberfest, etc, etc.

 

LMEs - Liquid Malt Extracts and DMEs - Dry Malt Extracts - are nothing more than wort that has been rendered down to a thick syrup or a powder-like consistancy.  These, once added to water (reconstituded) can be boiled along with a measure of hops to get the desired hop profile into the beer.

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From pg 24 of Charlie Papazian's The Complete Joy of Home Brewing, 4th ed.

 

"Many beer kits do not instruct the homebrewer to boil their ingredients: however, your beer will always be much better if your ingredients are boiled for at least 45 minutes.  So open your can of hop flavored malt extract and add it to a pot of water.  Stir to dissolve all of the ingredients and bring to a boil for 60 minutes."

 

WOW was that ever a mistake/typo/goof/flub.  The whole purpose of HMEs is that a brewer already developed a specific profile that s/he thought was good.  To completely change the bitter/taste/aroma profile by doing a boil that will randomly push those attributes "someplace" is just silly.  Plus, if you were going to do a 60 minute boil, why wouldnt you just use L/DME and your own hops to create the profile you are looking for?  If Charlie has an email address in his book send him a note as I would be interested in knowing why he is suggesting this especially to newbie brewers.

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ProTip:

 

Make sure you stir your LME really well before you bring it to a boil.  Its much more dense than water and you don't want it to sit on the bottom of your pot and get burned.

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ProTip:

 

Make sure you stir your LME really well before you bring it to a boil.  Its much more dense than water and you don't want it to sit on the bottom of your pot and get burned.

 

That's really a dumb suggestion.  Do you think we're stupid?  I mean who (RickBeer) would ever scorch their LME (RickBeer) by adding it with the flame on (RickBeer) and trying to scrape the last little bit out of the container while the flame scorched the rest (RickBeer), making him toss it and go buy another 7.2 pounds (RickBeer)?

 

Turn OFF the flame.  Add your LME and stir it good.  Turn flame back on.  This for the stupid people out there (RickBeer).   :lol:

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Ha ha Rick!

 

I rarely turn the flame off as 9 times out of 10 I have already misplaced my lighter and thus would ruin a batch of beer while spending the next hour looking for it.  I just stir stir stir.

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Boil water, remove from heat

Add LME, stir really well, bring back to boil

Add hops and continue to boil for whatever set time you want

Remove from heat, add HME

Stir, pour into fermenter

 

I want to make sure I understand the hops - going to try a recipe that calls for them -

 

We are putting the hops in AND never removing them per the recipe instructions? I don't see where it says to remove them. We are just leaving them in the hop sack & wort and adding all of that to the LBK?

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Long boils are for the bittering hops, I'll post a chart below so you'll see what I mean. For MrB no boil is needed, unless you want to do a flavor/aroma addition. Just remember do not boil the HME(can)

 

attachicon.gifhop_utilization.jpg

 

Jim:

 

The percentage on the jpg - is that IBUs? Does the desired affect relate to the type of hops that you use?

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No that is how efficiently your utilizing the hops for the particular boil your doing. i.e. For an Aroma boil 100% efficiency is reached in 7 min.

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Jim:

 

The percentage on the jpg - is that IBUs? Does the desired affect relate to the type of hops that you use?

IBU's are a measurement of total bitterness.  Any hops that are boiled for any amount of time will add IBU.  The weight of your hops and the time they are boiled is where you get your rating.

 

I would recommend downloading Qbrew and putting in an all-grain recipe so you can see just how the IBU changes when you put hops like 1oz Warrior for 60 minutes.

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IBU's are a measurement of total bitterness.  Any hops that are boiled for any amount of time will add IBU.  The weight of your hops, and the time they are boiled is where you get your rating.

 

I would recommend downloading Qbrew and putting in an all-grain recipe so you can see just how the IBU changes when you put hops like 1oz Warrior for 60 minutes.

You left something out. The Alpha Acid %.  Check your actual hops alpha against the % fixed by qbrew or any program.  The hops I get seem to be a higher % than assigned by BeerSmith.

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You left something out. The Alpha Acid %.  Check your actual hops alpha against the % fixed by qbrew or any program.  The hops I get seem to be a higher % than assigned by BeerSmith.

 

 

Yep, always check your ingredients; my German Tettnanger's Alpha was much lower than Qbrew's database.

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I want to make sure I understand the hops - going to try a recipe that calls for them -

 

We are putting the hops in AND never removing them per the recipe instructions? I don't see where it says to remove them. We are just leaving them in the hop sack & wort and adding all of that to the LBK?

I think you want to remove any bittering or flavoring hops before you transfer the wort to your fermenter. The idea is that if you have added hops to the boil you have added them for a specific amount of time (it may be 60 minutes (sometimes longer) or it may be 10 or 15 minutes). After that time is done you will be ready to transfer the wort and so you typically remove the hop bag or else rack the wort off any sediment. Since you have removed the wort from the heat ("flameout") and since the bitterness and falvor is extracted by boiling water then allowing those hops to simply stew in the wort may add grassy flavors. Hops used for their aroma may be different. Sometimes you will add these to the fermenter so you are not using the heat to extract aromatics

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I think you want to remove any bittering or flavoring hops before you transfer the wort to your fermenter. The idea is that if you have added hops to the boil you have added them for a specific amount of time (it may be 60 minutes (sometimes longer) or it may be 10 or 15 minutes). After that time is done you will be ready to transfer the wort and so you typically remove the hop bag or else rack the wort off any sediment. Since you have removed the wort from the heat ("flameout") and since the bitterness and falvor is extracted by boiling water then allowing those hops to simply stew in the wort may add grassy flavors. Hops used for their aroma may be different. Sometimes you will add these to the fermenter so you are not using the heat to extract aromatics

 

Yep, no need for "spent" hops to go into primary.

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If the instructions don't specifically say to remove the hops from the batch, you will leave them in through the entirety of the fermentation.

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There is no reason to remove hops added to a boil before adding to your fermenter as far as taste goes - everything has been extracted during the boil.  Edit - as I was typing, ohsigmachi said the same thing, noting "spent hops".

 

There is no reason to KEEP the hops and add them either.  I go commando and strain most of them out.

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There is no reason to remove hops added to a boil before adding to your fermenter as far as taste goes - everything has been extracted during the boil.  Edit - as I was typing, ohsigmachi said the same thing, noting "spent hops".

 

There is no reason to KEEP the hops and add them either.  I go commando and strain most of them out.

 Whoa... did I beat Rickbeer to the punch? Is this real life?

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 Whoa... did I beat Rickbeer to the punch? Is this real life?

 

RickBeer is on vacation with his family, and only posting here as time permits, so enjoy your claim to infamy while you can...    :lol:

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There is no reason to remove hops added to a boil before adding to your fermenter as far as taste goes - everything has been extracted during the boil.  Edit - as I was typing, ohsigmachi said the same thing, noting "spent hops".

 

There is no reason to KEEP the hops and add them either.  I go commando and strain most of them out.

I use muslin bags for all the boils and pour them all into fermenter.

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I use muslin bags for all the boils and pour them all into fermenter.

 

I use muslin sleaves for boils and I DON'T put them in... I guess at the end of the day it may not matter.

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From pg 24 of Charlie Papazian's The Complete Joy of Home Brewing, 4th ed.

 

"Many beer kits do not instruct the homebrewer to boil their ingredients: however, your beer will always be much better if your ingredients are boiled for at least 45 minutes.  So open your can of hop flavored malt extract and add it to a pot of water.  Stir to dissolve all of the ingredients and bring to a boil for 60 minutes."

 

I am not advocating boiling HME, merely stating that some books considered a good read for new brewers sometimes contain conflicting data and that may attribute to some confusion to new brewers about what kinds of malt extracts are meant to be boiled and what their purpose for boiling is.

 

I just read the same thing today, glad I found this thread and it's already been covered. I was just about to start a thread and ask about the same thing.

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I watched a video today on youtube where they said to boil the HME for 10 minutes!

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They're like "watch us upgrade Mr. Beer" while we boil this HME for 10 minutes!

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"upgrade" as in make a steep more steep? (pun intended) :rolleyes:

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They basically replaced the booster with steeping pale and crystal malt.  Big deal.

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They're like "watch us upgrade Mr. Beer" while we boil this HME for 10 minutes!

that sounds roughly like "hold my beer and watch this!" you know nothing good'll come from it. :lol:

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actually it is, grain is always superior to powder.

Just like following a recipe for AG is superior to using extracts where someone has already followed an AG recipe and saved you 4 hours?

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Just like following a recipe for AG is superior to using extracts where someone has already followed an AG recipe and saved you 4 hours?

 

On Thanksgiving do y'all cook a turkey or just break out a TV dinner? Look at all the time somebody saved you.

 

I have never said you can't make a good ale with extracts. All of my "House beers" started as extracts.

 

1) I follow no ones recipe, I make my own. Takes less time to look up the style requirements  than it to fish around till you find a recipe that may not even be "in style"

 

2) That's as different as making chili from scratch or making it from one of those flavor packs...which do you really think is going to taste better? 

 

3) The big thing is, that ain't even what I'm saying. You seem to have got more out of my statement than I put in it. So for the record; I say that steeping grains is superior to just adding a booster. With booster your adding some maltodextrin and dextrose.  The crystal alone replaces the maltodextrin and it also brings a caramel flavor to the table that booster don't have. Same with the pale malt, it brings flavors to the brew you don't get from a booster.  Steeping grain(s) is also about the flavor profile not just "mouth feel". (chase flavor not ABV)

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Can I buy a cold turkey, put it in the oven, and bake it half the day? Sure.  But can I also buy a turkey that day that someone baked for me? Absolutely.  If they're used with the same ingredients, is one better than the other?

 

Adding flavors is completely subjective.  If, statistically, the results are the same, then any other differences that are better or worse are completely based upon the consumer.

 

One could easily argue that if it takes 5 minutes to mix in some booster versus the hour plus it takes to get the same results(aside from taste) from steeping grains, then booster is far superior.

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Having someone else cook your Thanksgiving bird is too lazy. And yes one is decidedly better than the other. Thinking that any restaurant is better than or even equal to home cooking is sad beyond words.

 

I want to be clear here, if we were talking just carapils vs maltodextrin I'd agree with you (I'm never agreeable to adding corn sugar just to boost the ABV). However we're talking grains that do more in this case.

 

The man thinks the flavor the grains produce is subjective(shakes head sadly). Taste is the whole point, man. They added the crystal and pale malt  to accomplish a specific goal/flavor profile. 

 

Who told you steeping takes 60 min? Hot flash, they lied takes 30 and(when I was doing MrB) I managed to get it done while setting up and sanitizing the equipment(multi-tasking) So it actually only added some 5 min to the brew day (actually setting up the steep pot and heating the water) I truly don't get your obvious aversion to steeping. AG or even partial mash I get, they are a lot of work. Steeps are sit and forget till the timer goes off.

.

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Having someone else cook your Thanksgiving bird is too lazy. And yes one is decidedly better than the other. Thinking that any restaurant is better than or even equal to home cooking is sad beyond words.

 

I want to be clear here, if we were talking just carapils vs maltodextrin I'd agree with you (I'm never agreeable to adding corn sugar just to boost the ABV). However we're talking grains that do more in this case.

 

The man thinks the flavor the grains produce is subjective(shakes head sadly). Taste is the whole point, man. They added the crystal and pale malt  to accomplish a specific goal/flavor profile. 

 

Who told you steeping takes 60 min? Hot flash, they lied takes 30 and(when I was doing MrB) I managed to get it done while setting up and sanitizing the equipment(multi-tasking) So it actually only added some 5 min to the brew day (actually setting up the steep pot and heating the water) I truly don't get your obvious aversion to steeping. AG or even partial mash I get, they are a lot of work. Steeps are sit and forget till the timer goes off.

.

I'm never going to tell a professional cook that cooks EVERY DAY that I can cook anything that they do better arbitrarily just because it was made at home.  That is completely bonkers.  The tv is FILLED with cooking competitions that give cooks equal ingredients only to see some fail and some succeed.

 

And again, your argument would be that adding hops makes the beer taste better.  Again... that's subjective.  So is adding ANYTHING that changes the original flavor.  You may like it while others may not.  You can't tell them they are wrong because they don't share your taste.

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I'm never going to tell a professional cook that cooks EVERY DAY that I can cook anything that they do better arbitrarily just because it was made at home.  That is completely bonkers.  The tv is FILLED with cooking competitions that give cooks equal ingredients only to see some fail and some succeed.

 

And again, your argument would be that adding hops makes the beer taste better.  Again... that's subjective.  So is adding ANYTHING that changes the original flavor.  You may like it while others may not.  You can't tell them they are wrong because they don't share your taste.

I didn't ask you what you'd tell anybody, I ask who's food was better, and you equivocate.

 

I never in my life said adding more hops helps any beer. I am not a hophead. 

 

We're discussing steeping grains vs. booster and following a recipe. The flavor grains add is not subjective, that is what the wort IS, grain flavor with some hops added for bitterness and as a preservative. You make recipes from HMEs, by this discussion your telling people don't brew my recipes cause I changed what MrB wanted to do!  That's just silly, you do that every time you use a booster. We are talking about a recipe that calls for steeping grains and you seem to think a booster is an even trade.  In this case it ain't, there is nothing subjective about it. besides a baby raise in the ABV all it brings is maltodextrin.

 

@ Rick: what I read was 20-30 min and in this hobby time is your friend and you should use all of it you can.

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Jim - agree, 30 is fine.  I used to do 30, now do 20, no difference.  I was just confirming it's not an hour.

 

In fact, I did it this morning.  And Wednesday morning also.  

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Thinking that any restaurant is better than or even equal to home cooking is sad beyond words.

 

Adding hops, or steeping grains, or malt, or honey, or sugar, or syrup, or anything changes the flavor of the original...

 

Flavor is 100%, without a doubt, sub-jec-tive.

 

actually it is, grain is always superior to powder.

The video said that steeping grains were better than booster because they were grains not corn solids.

 

Better how?  Superior how?

If the answer is taste... guess what?!!!!  That, once again, is:

 

DING DING DING

SUBJECTIVE!!!!

 

Why don't you call Yuengling and tell them that you are 100% certain that they would sell more beer if they went to an all malt recipe instead of using adjuncts.

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Sadly  for all your arguments taste ain't subjective, only if you like it or not is subjective. Grain adds flavor as evidenced in both beer and bread.  So your arguments are specious, and faulty at the core. The worst part is you already know it. Shown by the fact that you cannot keep this to the one recipe that we are discussing. I have never said don't use adjuncts. Fact is I'm brewing a cream ale tomorrow it's going to have both flaked corn and 5 oz of dextrose, as dictated by style. My APA has 1 lb of flaked corn, it's an American brew it needs either corn or rice and I don't like rice, so. The same with my Cincy Common it has flaked corn and amber candi sugar. As dictated by brewing notes from 1886 or was it 7(been a couple years since I researched that sub-style). Nothing wrong with adjuncts, they have their place as does grains.  You sure seem awful defensive 'cause I say in this instance the grains are superior. It don't matter how large you type it or what sound effects you add to it. Don't change the none existent meat of your stance, that booster is better than any steep. If you can show me a DME or LME that is just say crystal 10L, I will allow it would be just as good as adding a 10L steep, but you can't cause they don't make such a thing.  So if you desire a little more complexity to the brew by adding some more caramel then your only choice is to steep some crystal. Just like adjuncts, steeps have their place

 

I'm still confused by this, all I'm saying is steeping the grains brings a complexity to this brew a booster cannot, and so is superior. Why are you trying to prove me wrong on something I'm not wrong about?  From a "chase flavor..." stand point, I'm giving the proper advice.

 

One more thing about cooking. You probably noticed from my pic I'm fat. I ain't fat 'cause momma's a good cook. I'm a good cook, not a trained chief . Just someone who enjoys cooking and taught by my Mom. It also so happens that a friend of a friend who is named Luther, and he won 3rd place in the country for BBQ before the TV shows started. You internet geeks find a guy named Luther from Columbus GA that's him. I've seen his trophy's and ate his ribs...they're to die for. I would never compare my ribs to his and I make some pretty fair spare ribs. My Yankee Pot Roast, Chili, or Lasagna is a whole 'nother story. I'm willing to bet mine are better than his, and have told him so. So yeah, I'll tell a professional chief I'm willing compete outside his specialty. (I've been cooking since I was 13, I turn 60 in Aug.) though several conversations with him has left me less than sanguine on the chili competition part.(sounds like he makes a damn good chili)

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Is there some kind of thrill that I'm missing in getting a thread locked out?

 

Listen; Comparing Booster to grains is a-kin to comparing apples to oranges.  Bananas to grape-fruit.  They're not even close to the same thing.

 

I personally feel that booster is a cheap, easy way to raise the ABV of a beer and does nothing esle for the beer.  The detriment that it thins out the beer makes it a no-brainer in my mind that I won't use it.

 

Grains on the other hand also raise ABV (but not as much as Booster does) but as an added bonus improve the mouth-feel and taste of the beer.  Who doesn't want to make a beer that tastes and feels better?

 

Yes!  Steeping grains is more work than dissolving Booster.  But then you name me one thing that we eat or drink that doesn't improve when we put a little more time and care into it.  Even frozen pizza tastes better when I add a little more cheese, some fresh mushrooms and a few sprinkles of various spices to it and then altered the cooking schedule as it bakes in the oven.

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Subjective vs Objective

Subjective information is one person's opinion. In a newspaper, the editorial section is the place for subjectivity. It can be based on fact, but it is one person's interpretation of that fact. In this way, subjective information is also analytical.

Student research papers are usually subjective, in that the writer formulates a thesis statement and uses sources that support that thesis. Bear in mind that there is usually another equally valid viewpoint that can be supported with other sources.

Objective information reviews many points of view. It is intended to be unbiased. News reporters are supposed to be objective and report the facts of an event. Encyclopedias and other reference materials provide objective information.

 

Boring (i.e. this discussion)  :lol: 

 

Synonyms for boring
adj uninteresting
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Jim - agree, 30 is fine.  I used to do 30, now do 20, no difference.  I was just confirming it's not an hour.

 

In fact, I did it this morning.  And Wednesday morning also.  

wish I could work 2 brew days in a week. I'd never run out of beer.

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I added more fermenters from the Target sale, and decided to double up for a few brewing cycles since I was down in a few favorites, since the fermenting freezer had plenty of space, and since I thought it would be better to do more each brewing week versus stretching it out.  I ended up finding it very laborious - bottling on day one, fermenting the next day, bottling the day after, and brewing on the 4th day.  I did this starting in late January, then again in late February, then again just now.  I can say that after brewing those 30 gallons I won't be doing it again this way - I found it very tedious.  It would be better to space them out a week - i.e. bottle on day 1, brew on day 2 (because everything is out already), then bottle on day 8 and brew on day 9.

 

It did help me ramp up my inventory - I was around 5 or 6 cases as I recall, now have just over 10 cases, with just over 8 cases conditioning and 4 more cases currently brewing.  By the end of April I expect to have around 20 - 21 cases of drinkable beer.  End of April my youngest graduates from grad school and I wanted to have a Blue Moon clone ready, plus a wheat beer to add flavors to, as well as rebuild my inventory.  No big party planned, but for the handful we have I wanted selection.

 

When I bottle the two batches I made this week the first week of April, I have no plans to brew anything else, everything has sufficient inventory.  Probably take a few months off of brewing until I work the inventory down.

 

Yesterday I picked up around 12 cases of bottles for $25, all were clean, heading outside to sort them and figure out what I'm keeping and what I'm taking back for deposits because I don't want them (like short, fat bottles).  I only need about 6 cases of empties more for my needs.

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Not the fermenters, I don't think I can take the 2 days on my feet. Takes me most of the week to get over Sat.

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This thread got really off topic. Started out about boiling wort, then went to turkeys  :)

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*shakes fist at Papazian*

I have to admit that I have over boiled my HMEs.  Not all of them but some.  But I did read The Complete Joy of Home Brewing and took his 60min boil to heart.

So the HME is ready to go... got it. 

As far as boiling LME and DME I have a few questions.

Do the hop goodness bind any different to boiled extract or plain water.  I know from my young days of dabbling in THC that certain "key aspects" of that bind to some things and not others and hops is in the same family, Cannabaceae.

Are LME and DME susceptible to the temperature dependent "nibbling and chopping" of Alpha-amylase and Beta-amylase or was that already taken care of when they were made into malt extracts?

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yeah that's what I figured from my previous adventures in the family.  However the Sierra Nevada Hop Hunter that I'm drinking at the moment (so good) says it uses "steam distilled hop oils". Well I'm sure they have some other tricks in there as well besides mere steam.

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Steam extraction of hop oils happens in what can only be described as a bong.

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Tea is a waste of hops. I'm not saying you won't get anything from it but...You need the sugars in wort to get the maximum effect from the hop oil conversion.  What this really means is, I'm cheap and want to get the maximum effect from the minimum amount of hops. Put another way. It is a fact that a 5 min. aroma boil lasts longer than a 2 week dry hop. Why? You need 160f + to convert hop oils for aroma, and a 20 min boil for 100% conversion for flavor. Now a definition in terms. If you look at a hop cone with a magnifying glass(I have) you'll see little amber chunks(at least they're amber in cascade) In amongst the "leaves". That is the flavor, aroma, and bitter,  those are the hop oils I am referring to.

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On my latest beer from Sunday (Imperial India Black Ale), I am basically using hops in every way imaginable from 60, 20, 7, and a DH.  But there's no tea involved.  Every minute of hop boil was done in malt extract.

 

This beer will be conditioning for months so I added the DH try and get more aroma without adding bitterness.  I hear that the aroma will fade over time while the bitterness will stay.

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If your making an IPA (and even though it pains me to say it.) you have to dry hop, it's in the flavor profile.  Not an IPA if you don't dry hop. Regardless to anything else, you have to brew true to style the first time. You have to have a baseline for comparison.

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The beauty of a good dry hop is the abundance of aroma in the head.  Which, in turn, leads to head retention... oh noes...

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Steam extraction of hop oils happens in what can only be described as a bong.

yeah man that totally looks like a bong... harhar...wait what?

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