Jump to content
Mr.Beer Community
76shovel

how to handle a true lager?

Recommended Posts

first Lager and my search-fu must be lacking.

 

I have Helles Bock fermenting at 55F. As I understand it at the end of my 3 weeks I should give it 3 days at 65-70F?  Then bottle and condition cold again? One Lager blog I read said to bottle then chill by dialing the temps down 5 degrees per day until it's a 35 then hold it there for at least a month.  I see nothing like this in the Helles Bock instructions. Sound right?

 

Any input appreciated.

 Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've never made a lager, but it was my understanding that the cold temps were associated with the fermentation only since lager yeasts ferments from the bottom. I could be wrong. The replies should be interesting.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As I'm going to be doing my first lagers in a couple of months, I'm looking forward to the answers too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe that is correct. Cool fermentation, how cool depends  upon the yeast variety, warm it up a couple of days, then cool lager period (not sure how cool). Once bottled, just like any beer. You probably need to rack to a secondary for lagering.  Keep us posted.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With my Hops O'Plenty IPL (India Pale Lager), my schedule is as follows:

Primary for 10-12 days at 55.0 F until fermentation slows

Diacetyl Rest for 2 days at 65.0 F
Secondary for 14 days at 50.0 F ending at 45.0 F
Tertiary for 21 days at 45.0 F ending at 40.0 F

That was back when I was doing them all in buckets or carboys.  Now that I use conicals, it will all be in the same vessel.  The times and temps still hold true.
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good info, kedogn, but that's for all-grain, right?  Things would be different for a MRB recipe, wouldn't it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Shrike said:

Good info, kedogn, but that's for all-grain, right?  Things would be different for a MRB recipe, wouldn't it?

Actually, I use the same schedule for that beer when I do it as AG or using DME.   I mean, I would think that fermentation is fermentation.   I wouldn't think it would matter much what you used to get there, especially since we are talking about temperature control for fermentation, ya know?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd really love to see @MRB Josh R or @MRB Tim chime in for clarity.  Only one of the MRB lager recipe instructions mentions bringing it up to room temperature for the last three days (yes, I just looked at the instructions for all 15 lager recipes.  I'd say I need a hobby but this is one of them :) ).  Not-so-coincidentally, it's for the newest recipe, ChromosBeer.  I'm assuming the older recipes just haven't been updated to include the diacetyl rest.  Is this correct or is it not important for them?

Also, should we be carbonating these at room temperature and then conditioning at colder temps?  The only instructions that mention carbonating/conditioning temps are Saazquatch, Mad Ludwig. Baby Got Bock, Honey Maibock, May the Schwarz, and German Doppelbock.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All my previous batches were of course ales and carb/condition in the bottle, I intended to do the same for this Helles bock lager, bad move? 

After the fermentation  then the "Diacetyl Rest for 2 days at 65.0 F"........ and bottle with the usual sugar cubes ( ok?)

..... and that leads me back around to the same question as Shrike,  then what? The usual 70-75F for 1 to 2 months or back in the fridge at 50F for a cool conditioning.?

 

Sorry, I guess I should have read ahead on lager brewing. :wacko:

 

 Mark

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

look at my thread "Recipe for Helles".  I'm cold conditioning 80 bottles right now, and have explained what my procedure were.  Can't say it's the right thing to do, but no one has corrected me yet.

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, MiniYoda said:

look at my thread "Recipe for Helles".  I'm cold conditioning 80 bottles right now, and have explained what my procedure were.  Can't say it's the right thing to do, but no one has corrected me yet.

 

 

I have not found your thread yet MiniYoda but I did find a 2015 thread on Helles Bock bottling where MRB Josh R said to carbonate them at 70 then move them back to the cooler temps for conditioning.  That supports the posts from Brian and Kedogn too.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, MiniYoda said:

Sorry, guess I should have posted the link

 

http://community.mrbeer.com/topic/36452-recipe-for-helles/#comment-460608

 

 

Thanks. Since his is my first attempt at Helles Bock, and to be honest about it I have no other personal experience with this type of beer, whatever I make is going to be "Great!"  I should probably try to find something similar off the shelf locally so I have some frame of reference.

 

appreciate the info!

Mark

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/17/2017 at 1:30 PM, Shrike said:

I'd really love to see @MRB Josh R or @MRB Tim chime in for clarity.  Only one of the MRB lager recipe instructions mentions bringing it up to room temperature for the last three days (yes, I just looked at the instructions for all 15 lager recipes.  I'd say I need a hobby but this is one of them :) ).  Not-so-coincidentally, it's for the newest recipe, ChromosBeer.  I'm assuming the older recipes just haven't been updated to include the diacetyl rest.  Is this correct or is it not important for them?

Also, should we be carbonating these at room temperature and then conditioning at colder temps?  The only instructions that mention carbonating/conditioning temps are Saazquatch, Mad Ludwig. Baby Got Bock, Honey Maibock, May the Schwarz, and German Doppelbock.

 

This is mostly correct. While I've made all of those recipes as-is and they were good, doing a D-rest for a few days before bottling will benefit them.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the answer!  Now, after carbonating at room temperature, will these benefit from conditioning at cooler temps?  My conditioning options are:
1)  Room temperature.

2)  In a wine fridge at a lowest temp of 55F.  I can fit two batches in this.

3)  Six-to-nine bottles at a time in my beer fridge.

 

In your experience, which would be best?  Worst?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Shrike said:

Thanks for the answer!  Now, after carbonating at room temperature, will these benefit from conditioning at cooler temps?  My conditioning options are:
1)  Room temperature.

2)  In a wine fridge at a lowest temp of 55F.  I can fit two batches in this.

3)  Six-to-nine bottles at a time in my beer fridge.

 

In your experience, which would be best?  Worst?

 

 

Unless I read otherwise, for the Helles I plan to finish the 55 degree fermentation then the rest at 70, carbonate in the bottle at 70 for 2 weeks then back to 50-55 for a month, then to the drinking fridge @ 40F.

If I am wrong, for the love of beer someone stop me! :lol:

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, 76shovel said:

Unless I read otherwise, for the Helles I plan to finish the 55 degree fermentation then the rest at 70, carbonate in the bottle at 70 for 2 weeks then back to 50-55 for a month, then to the drinking fridge @ 40F.

If I am wrong, for the love of beer someone stop me! :lol:

 

This is correct. :)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, MRB Josh R said:

 

This is correct. :)

 

This better be good beer.   LOL!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks.  Remember that a true Lager isn't the easiest of beers to make, but well worth the effort.  Don't be discouraged if your first attempt isn't commercial quality.  Just sit back, enjoy the fruit of your labor, and try again

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, MiniYoda said:

Remember that a true Lager isn't the easiest of beers to make,

I'm sorry, shouldn't that have been, "the easiest a true lager to make is not"??  ;)

 

P.S.. its my Friday at work ('regular' job) and I am feeling a little squirrely :)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

New ground for me.... I am getting close to the two day diacetyl rest.  There is a pretty healthy layer of Trub on the bottom but there is also what appears to be quite a layer of "floaties"  on the top. Does that settle out or is it going to increase as the mix warms? I do anything with this to keep it out of my bottles?

 

thanks

 Mark

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In my personal experience (others may beg to disagree), the floaties don't increase or decrease during Diacetyl rest.  And it won't settle out.  Basically, it goes into your last bottle of beer, which I always flag (sharpie X on metal bottle caps, sticker on PET bottles).  That's my "drink this first" bottle.  It tells me how the beer is conditioning, and due to settlement I don't give it to anyone.

 

I don't try to do anything to keep it out of the bottle.  I just accept it as the "drink this first" bottle.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, MiniYoda said:

In my personal experience (others may beg to disagree), the floaties don't increase or decrease during Diacetyl rest.  And it won't settle out.  Basically, it goes into your last bottle of beer, which I always flag (sharpie X on metal bottle caps, sticker on PET bottles).  That's my "drink this first" bottle.  It tells me how the beer is conditioning, and due to settlement I don't give it to anyone.

 

I don't try to do anything to keep it out of the bottle.  I just accept it as the "drink this first" bottle.

I do that with every batch, this Helle's is my first that had anything of consequence floating on top.   Thanks! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

for me, after my Diacetyl rest, I carb'ed the bottles at regular carb temp for two weeks, then came the fun.

 

Put them in a fridge at almost close to room temp, then lower the temp every day by about two degrees.  The fridge's temp was controlled by this

 

https://www.mrbeer.com/digital-temperature-controller-outlet-thermostat

 

Remember that Lager in German basically somewhat means "storage".  But, lager yeast love cold temps.  The best thing you can do is to put the bottles in a fridge at the carb temp, then drop the fridge's temp by 2 degrees every day, until you hit around 35.  My 80 bottles of four different recipes of helles have been lagering in the fridge for just short of a month now.  Missed Oktoberfest, but I will keep them there now at 35 degrees until I feel like I'd like a good lager.

 

Or Thanksgiving, which ever comes first.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, now learning that some of the bigger beers will take 3 to 6 months or more from start to finish so I need to start thinking at least a season ahead. This Helles I have perking is a spring version but it will be interesting to see if I can wait that long.

 

Would you carbonate for 2 or for 3 weeks? 

 

I have the Inkbird controller running the little fridge the Helles is fermenting in at 55F. After the room temp carbonation those bottles will go into that fridge for the slow dial down. I know I can hit 40F not sure about 35 but I doubt my unsophisticated taste buds will know the difference. Being downstairs to lower the temp every day is no big deal, my wife says I check on my brews like Ebenezer counting his coin.

 

I just tell her I'm getting my steps in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So this Helles got 3 weeks fermenting at 55F,2 day rest at 70. Bottled in the 740 ml bottles with 4 sugar cubes in each bottle and since then has been in 72 degree temps for 3 days, Bottles are still dead soft.  Waiting, waiting......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2 weeks of carbonation at 70-75 and over week back in the fridge slowly dialing temps down using my inkbird. These bottles have gained some pressure but certainly not as firm as the Ales I am used to.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looking back at this Helles my initial bottling was 10/01, I know it's way early but I couldn't stand it and opened a bottle tonight, 10/27. I have no frame of reference for this type of beer but even now I know I like it.  At this point I can set this one back and wait while I enjoy other fruits of my labor.

 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lager 

 

So, in German, "Lager" means storeroom or warehouse.  To make a *true* lager, takes time. A few months of storage.  Best you can do is make a batch, put it away....COOL, and a few months later, it will be great.  Hard to reist, but in time comes good things.  It is hard to make a true lager, but I will get there myself....someday

 

Oh.....want a challenge?  Brew a true Marzen.  The German word Marzen means..........?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Märzen

 

adoYiniM

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, MiniYoda said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lager 

 

So, in German, "Lager" means storeroom or warehouse.  To make a *true* lager, takes time. A few months of storage.  Best you can do is make a batch, put it away....COOL, and a few months later, it will be great.  Hard to reist, but in time comes good things.  It is hard to make a true lager, but I will get there myself....someday

 

Oh.....want a challenge?  Brew a true Marzen.  The German word Marzen means..........?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Märzen

 

adoYiniM

 

 

Quote

 

Is 40-45F too cool for the lagering?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

40-45 should be good for lagering.   I just put my bottles in the fridge and let them sit there at fridge temp for lagering

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

bumping this one, because I just ordered two Lager kits, and am getting ready to use the lager fridge.

 

Have a question, and this is coming from an old geezer who is only half drunk (I'm working on it).  Correct me if I wrong, but basically the difference between logering and conditioning is the temp.  You "lager" beers with lager yeast at or around 40 degrees, and you "condition" beers with ale yeast at room temperature.  Correct?  If this is correct, then basically any lager based beer could be a good for Oktoberfest if made in March, stored in a fridge, and enjoyed in September.  Yes, there is a true Marzen/Oktoberfest style, but if I were to take any Mr. Beer recipe, such as Austin Pils or Mad Ludwig's Marzen, or Munich Malt Monster, and "lager" them for 6 months at 40 degrees or so, they should come out better than if they were stored at room temp for 6 months.

 

Just wondering, because I'd like to make some lager beers in March, and enjoy them in September, and am willing to sacrifice space in a fridge to "lager" them at a cold temp.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, MiniYoda said:

bumping this one, because I just ordered two Lager kits, and am getting ready to use the lager fridge.

 

Have a question, and this is coming from an old geezer who is only half drunk (I'm working on it).  Correct me if I wrong, but basically the difference between logering and conditioning is the temp.  You "lager" beers with lager yeast at or around 40 degrees, and you "condition" beers with ale yeast at room temperature.  Correct?  If this is correct, then basically any lager based beer could be a good for Oktoberfest if made in March, stored in a fridge, and enjoyed in September.  Yes, there is a true Marzen/Oktoberfest style, but if I were to take any Mr. Beer recipe, such as Austin Pils or Mad Ludwig's Marzen, or Munich Malt Monster, and "lager" them for 6 months at 40 degrees or so, they should come out better than if they were stored at room temp for 6 months.

 

Just wondering, because I'd like to make some lager beers in March, and enjoy them in September, and am willing to sacrifice space in a fridge to "lager" them at a cold temp.

I “lager” my beers before theyre bottled. For example:

 

1-brew

2-secondary(optional) and DR

3-lager in secondary for a few weeks, depends on your OG

4-bottle

5-condition

6-drink

 

now heres what i have done in the past also. 

1-brew

2-DR

3-keg

4- lager

5- serve

 

Beer is always better conditioned (@ room temp). Even ipas are better conditioned for a few weeks. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let me speak again. I actully just pulled a lager out of my cold closet just a few hours ago to DR. Ill probably dump the yeast (acting as a secondary), let it sit in the warm side for two days then ill push it back in the cold closet for a day or two and then keg. 

 

You see, ive done fast lagering and ive done slow lagering. Ive lowered the temp by 5 degrees everyday until it hits 35 to not shock the yeast. Ive lagered for weeks. Thats the slow way. Now i always do the fast way cuz theres really no difference to me. I secondary (sometimes ive even skipped that), crash to 35 immediately in secondary or in the keg and i keg when one is available or put the crashed keg in the cold closet until a keezer spot opens up.

 

my point is, dont get so caught up in the process. Id reccomend just leaving in the original LBK and crashing for a week maybe and then bottle and lager the bottles for a few weeks.  The process is a little different with an LBK. Yall dont really secondary in an LBK. I would feel confined not doing so also cuz you have a “burp lid” and dont have to worry about sanitizer suckback. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I refrigerate bottled lagers for keeping following a 3-4 week carbonation period at room temperature.  I will be the first to admit that I have much to learn before brewing the perfect lager, but I do know that trying to carbonate beer in bottles at 40 F does not work very well.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't use a secondary, basically because it's not something I've learned yet. I know, not hard, but I use the basic LBK to bottle method.  In the past, for me lagering meant fermenting in the 50's, two days at room temp for diastolic rest, then bottle and put back in the fridge to lager, lowering the temp from room to mid 30's two degrees each day.  My primary question is basically, would all Mr. Beer's recipes that have lager yeast benefit from long-term (5-6 months) lagering at 35 degrees

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

agreed, forgot about the carbonation.  make that

 

1 - ferment in the low 50's

2 - two days diastolic rest at room temp

3 - bottle and carbonate at room temp for 2 weeks

4 - put in fridge and lower temp 1-2 degrees every day from room temp until mid 30's

5 - the question.......can I leave lagers in the fridge in the mid 30's for 5-6 months?

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, MiniYoda said:

I don't use a secondary, basically because it's not something I've learned yet. I know, not hard, but I use the basic LBK to bottle method.  In the past, for me lagering meant fermenting in the 50's, two days at room temp for diastolic rest, then bottle and put back in the fridge to lager, lowering the temp from room to mid 30's two degrees each day.  My primary question is basically, would all Mr. Beer's recipes that have lager yeast benefit from long-term (5-6 months) lagering at 35 degrees

Once carbonated, I would say yes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I knew that spelling didn't look right.  FINALLY the beer is kicking in

 

and for those who were wondering what this old fat drunk was TRYING to say, it's Diacetyl rest

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sure, but the only lager I have in the fridge is Miller Lite.  I'll drink it with you, but give me a few months to have a Mr. Beer lager

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, MiniYoda said:

Sure, but the only lager I have in the fridge is Miller Lite.  I'll drink it with you, but give me a few months to have a Mr. Beer lager

 

 

K, I'll have a Munich Dunkel lager and you can have an ale.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, MiniYoda said:

Sure, but the only lager I have in the fridge is Miller Lite.  I'll drink it with you, but give me a few months to have a Mr. Beer lager

 

 Bottled my Helles 10/1  I'm gettin ready to get ready.

 

Quote

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/14/2018 at 5:50 AM, 76shovel said:

 Bottled my Helles 10/1  I'm gettin ready to get ready.

 

 

How did your Helles turn out? I have a can I’m going to brew soon but this whole lager topic has got me like....😳

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Jdub said:

How did your Helles turn out? I have a can I’m going to brew soon but this whole lager topic has got me like....😳

 

When I am kicked back having a beer I brewed I am always wondering if I got it right, I don't have any other experience with bocks but I like it. :) 

 

I recently bottled Uncle Monkey's Dunkel. Fermented 3 weeks at 55, 2 day rest in the basement at 65 then bottled, Now carbing 3 weeks at 70-72. When carbed it'll go to the basement fridge at 40 and wait for me. (Actually I'll be waiting for it.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Jdub said:

How did your Helles turn out? I have a can I’m going to brew soon but this whole lager topic has got me like....😳

Yeah, the lager conditioning stage would throw a wrench in my schedule!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The one thing I haven't fully understood yet is the lagering/conditioning temp.  My understanding is, ales condition at the same temp as they fermented, normally 65-68 degrees.  Lagers ferment in the lower 50's but a true lagering (I have two of them going from March until September) will ager in the 30's.  What would happen if I lagered in the same temp as fermentation for 4-5 months?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎1‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 7:49 PM, Creeps McLane said:

I forgot about carbing. Its been a long time since ive bottled

We just got a counter pressure bottle filler.  LOVE THAT THING!  Makes it so easy to bottle up samples for places or for me to bring bottles to friends, instead of full growlers. :)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/9/2018 at 5:51 AM, Cato said:

Yeah, the lager conditioning stage would throw a wrench in my schedule!

 

On 5/9/2018 at 5:53 AM, MiniYoda said:

The one thing I haven't fully understood yet is the lagering/conditioning temp.  My understanding is, ales condition at the same temp as they fermented, normally 65-68 degrees.  Lagers ferment in the lower 50's but a true lagering (I have two of them going from March until September) will ager in the 30's.  What would happen if I lagered in the same temp as fermentation for 4-5 months?

 

From what I've gleaned, the MRB lagers should carb at room temp for three weeks, then get lagered at their fermenting temperature.  That's what I've done...to a point.  I have an old wine fridge that I can get two full batches in.  So after bottling them they sat at room temp for three weeks then into the wine fridge they went.  I keep them there at 54*F until ready to drink, then I put one or two in the beer fridge for three days.

 

The down side is that last winter I brewed four batches of lager.  So two have been sitting at room temperature since bottling (this is why I brewed them during the winter - colder room temperature.)  As room opens in the wine fridge I rotate some of the ones sitting at room temperature into it.  But the ones that have stayed at room temperature have all been very tasty.  Would they have been better if "properly" lagered?  Quite possibly.  

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Shrike said:

 

 

From what I've gleaned, the MRB lagers should carb at room temp for three weeks, then get lagered at their fermenting temperature.  That's what I've done...to a point.  I have an old wine fridge that I can get two full batches in.  So after bottling them they sat at room temp for three weeks then into the wine fridge they went.  I keep them there at 54*F until ready to drink, then I put one or two in the beer fridge for three days.

 

The down side is that last winter I brewed four batches of lager.  So two have been sitting at room temperature since bottling (this is why I brewed them during the winter - colder room temperature.)  As room opens in the wine fridge I rotate some of the ones sitting at room temperature into it.  But the ones that have stayed at room temperature have all been very tasty.  Would they have been better if "properly" lagered?  Quite possibly.  

 

I've heard two different versions of the story.  Some say to lager at the same temp as fermentation (just like ales), and some say lager at refrigerator temps.  Perhaps @MRB Josh R can chime in and give us the answer

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

John Palmer says (quoting a familiar saying)

"Lager": I do not think this word means what you think it means

 

Check this out.

https://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-1-Common-Misconceptions_ep_58-1.html

*

I have only one issue with this. He says traditionally lagering was done in deep caverns. Deep caverns adopt the subterranean  temperature of the earth's crust and generally that is around 45-50 deg F. So much for lagering at 35 deg F.  (Unless this was in their outhouses back in the days of no central heating. Or in winter with a fair amount of air exchange into the cave.)

However, that does not mean that 35 deg lagering is bad just maybe not what was originally experienced.

*

So my take is that for an old fashioned beer, lager it at fermentation temps - otherwise do whatever you like :-D

Of course it could be that the caves used to have 2 areas, closer to the surface for most activity i.e. brewing, and lower down/farther in for cellaring. That would make the cellaring/lagering happen at a lower temp probably, but still not 35.

*

Anyway that is my interpretation.

*

Another good read

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/06/lets-talk-beer-styles-pilsner.html

 

Stranger than fiction....

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/did-lager-beer-originate-south-america-180964962/

 

*

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/14/2018 at 7:45 AM, MiniYoda said:

 

I've heard two different versions of the story.  Some say to lager at the same temp as fermentation (just like ales), and some say lager at refrigerator temps.  Perhaps @MRB Josh R can chime in and give us the answer

 

 

All lagers will lager at cold temps (35-45). The word "lager" means "cold storage". The closer you can get to freezing temps without actually freezing is best.

 

On 5/14/2018 at 9:20 AM, Nickfixit said:

John Palmer says (quoting a familiar saying)

"Lager": I do not think this word means what you think it means

 

Check this out.

https://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-1-Common-Misconceptions_ep_58-1.html

*

I have only one issue with this. He says traditionally lagering was done in deep caverns. Deep caverns adopt the subterranean  temperature of the earth's crust and generally that is around 45-50 deg F. So much for lagering at 35 deg F.  (Unless this was in their outhouses back in the days of no central heating. Or in winter with a fair amount of air exchange into the cave.)

However, that does not mean that 35 deg lagering is bad just maybe not what was originally experienced.

*

So my take is that for an old fashioned beer, lager it at fermentation temps - otherwise do whatever you like :-D

Of course it could be that the caves used to have 2 areas, closer to the surface for most activity i.e. brewing, and lower down/farther in for cellaring. That would make the cellaring/lagering happen at a lower temp probably, but still not 35.

*

Anyway that is my interpretation.

*

Another good read

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/06/lets-talk-beer-styles-pilsner.html

 

Stranger than fiction....

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/did-lager-beer-originate-south-america-180964962/

 

*

 

Yeah, they used to lager in caves back then, but we have refrigeration now and I can almost guarantee that the quality of lager we can make now is way beyond what they had when they were still lagering in caves.

 

When lagering, colder is always better.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I make 90% of my beers as Lager.  First of all, cool fermentation is necessary.  I tend to bring it up to room temp (about 72) prior to bottling.  I am fortunate in that I am able to lager them rather cool for as long as I want.  It takes a lot of work to make them in AZ (where I live) but I am not a fan of most IPA's and prefer the Pilzners and Lagers I grew up with in Wisconsin in the 50's and 60's.  For the most part, happy with the results. BTW, a conical fermenter with a wrap to keep items steady was a BIG help.

29261934_10156350988093534_4015906554766163968_n.jpg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Proper way to create a Helles Bier!  Works best in the cool early days of Spring!10256192_10203032067155699_5374450224817206260_n.jpg.dde033c1b8329e7206da956b12567498.jpg

 

 

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...