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There is just enough room in the pot for water to steep grains for a 2 gallon batch.

To do a 4 gallon batch, twice the grains will fit in pot, but not twice the water.

 

For a 4 gallon batch, can grains be doubled for steeping,

then just add more water when transferring to the fermentor ?

 

Thanks

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4 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

There is just enough room in the pot for water to steep grains for a 2 gallon batch.

To do a 4 gallon batch, twice the grains will fit in pot, but not twice the water.

 

For a 4 gallon batch, can grains be doubled for steeping,

then just add more water when transferring to the fermentor ?

 

Thanks

i don't know why you couldn't do that. there is some information out there about grains/water ratio for a proper mash. i can't quote what that is, but someone on here knows that.

 

What i do know is that you could get an inexpensive and bigger brew kettle pretty easily. i was using a walmart special 16 qt kettle for quite a while for 2 gal batches, and recently got a 5.5 gal kettle for christmas for larger batches (not walmart).

 

edit: read somewhere 1.5 quarts/1 lb of grain.

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9 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

There is just enough room in the pot for water to steep grains for a 2 gallon batch.

To do a 4 gallon batch, twice the grains will fit in pot, but not twice the water.

 

For a 4 gallon batch, can grains be doubled for steeping,

then just add more water when transferring to the fermentor ?

 

Thanks

I kinda follow you, but you also kinda lost me

 

can you make a higher gravity wort and then water it down? Sure. However, I just don’t think you’ll get the results you want from this.  I just imagine a super thick mash that will end up being a mess. 

 

I would say the easy way of doing what you want is to steep you specialty grains for the flavors you want, then use LME or DME as your base. 

 

If you’re heart is set on an all grain batch on your stove top in a pot that’s too small, then I would do one mash like it’s for a two gallon batch (1/2 the grains of your 4 gallon recipe), take out the grain, and then do a second mash with the wort from the first mash and the remaining grain. Follow me? Then water it down. This is a common thing when brewing high gravity beers. 

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3 hours ago, Creeps McLane said:

I kinda follow you, but you also kinda lost me

 

can you make a higher gravity wort and then water it down? Sure. However, I just don’t think you’ll get the results you want from this.  I just imagine a super thick mash that will end up being a mess. 

 

I would say the easy way of doing what you want is to steep you specialty grains for the flavors you want, then use LME or DME as your base. 

 

If you’re heart is set on an all grain batch on your stove top in a pot that’s too small, then I would do one mash like it’s for a two gallon batch (1/2 the grains of your 4 gallon recipe), take out the grain, and then do a second mash with the wort from the first mash and the remaining grain. Follow me? Then water it down. This is a common thing when brewing high gravity beers. 

 

Was thinking about a 2 gallon recipe and doubling it.

The recipe calls for 8oz malts & 3 lbs DME, can easily fit 16oz malts.

What I forgot, and to mention, was the 3 pounds DME.

I need to rethink this one, 6 pounds of malts is allot.

Was trying to work around getting a larger pot.

 

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So what you are wanting to know is can you steep #1 of grain in the same amount of water as the 8oz you normally do.  The short answer is yes.  I mash grains at 1.75 qt of water to 1# of grain and that is actually a thinner mash than what some use.  You could go to a ratio of 1.25qt/# and still be fine. 

 

It also sounds like you are wanting to do a boil for a 4 gallon batch.  There are several questions that need answered to give you a good response.  Are you wanting to do a full 60 minute boil of your wort?  How big of a pot do you have?  What is your complete recipe (6# DME may or may not be a lot)?

 

OK, I will make some assumptions here.  My guess is that you don't have a pot that will hold 5 gallons of wort and still have room for a boil. But  since you have been doing 2 gallon batches your pot can hold 3 gallons of wort and still be able to boil. If this is the case then you can steep your grains in the water you normally use for a 2 gallon batch and then add your DME and proceed with your boil as usual.  When the boil is complete you can cool your wort, transfer it to your fermentation vessel and "top off" with water to get to the 4 gallon mark.  Many extract brewers do it this way because they either don't have a pot large enough to boil 5 gallons of liquid or a burner capable of doing this since most kitchen stoves won't work. 

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1 hour ago, BDawg62 said:

So what you are wanting to know is can you steep #1 of grain in the same amount of water as the 8oz you normally do.  The short answer is yes.  I mash grains at 1.75 qt of water to 1# of grain and that is actually a thinner mash than what some use.  You could go to a ratio of 1.25qt/# and still be fine. 

 

It also sounds like you are wanting to do a boil for a 4 gallon batch.  There are several questions that need answered to give you a good response.  Are you wanting to do a full 60 minute boil of your wort?  How big of a pot do you have?  What is your complete recipe (6# DME may or may not be a lot)?

 

OK, I will make some assumptions here.  My guess is that you don't have a pot that will hold 5 gallons of wort and still have room for a boil. But  since you have been doing 2 gallon batches your pot can hold 3 gallons of wort and still be able to boil. If this is the case then you can steep your grains in the water you normally use for a 2 gallon batch and then add your DME and proceed with your boil as usual.  When the boil is complete you can cool your wort, transfer it to your fermentation vessel and "top off" with water to get to the 4 gallon mark.  Many extract brewers do it this way because they either don't have a pot large enough to boil 5 gallons of liquid or a burner capable of doing this since most kitchen stoves won't work. 

The insta-pot being used (2 gallon recipe) can only safely use one gallon, 8oz grain steep, 3lb DME & 60 min hop boil schedule.

That's been fine until now.  I am carefully considering all options and what direction I want to pursue with this.

Every day I wake up I have a new/different idea on what new equipment to get.  I am pausing for a bit until my mind has

a chance to absorb this tremendous amount of information, and what options are better suited for me.

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1 hour ago, Fire Rooster said:

The insta-pot being used (2 gallon recipe) can only safely use one gallon, 8oz grain steep, 3lb DME & 60 min hop boil schedule.

That's been fine until now.  I am carefully considering all options and what direction I want to pursue with this.

Every day I wake up I have a new/different idea on what new equipment to get.  I am pausing for a bit until my mind has

a chance to absorb this tremendous amount of information, and what options are better suited for me.

Go to Walmart or your local big box store and look for a 16qt pot.  You should be able to find a decent one for about $30, that will allow for a boil big enough to do your 4 gallon batches with top off to get to that volume.

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3 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

The insta-pot being used (2 gallon recipe) can only safely use one gallon, 8oz grain steep, 3lb DME & 60 min hop boil schedule.

That's been fine until now.  I am carefully considering all options and what direction I want to pursue with this.

Every day I wake up I have a new/different idea on what new equipment to get.  I am pausing for a bit until my mind has

a chance to absorb this tremendous amount of information, and what options are better suited for me.

 

From a guy (me) that only does 2-gal recipes in a 6-qt kettle, if I were you, (trying to do 4-gal recipes) I'd take BDawg's advice and enrich Walmart $30 for a bigger pot.  But I understand you not wanting to get bigger in equipment size, cause I don't want to either, yet.  

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7 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

The insta-pot being used (2 gallon recipe) can only safely use one gallon, 8oz grain steep, 3lb DME & 60 min hop boil schedule.

That's been fine until now.  I am carefully considering all options and what direction I want to pursue with this.

Every day I wake up I have a new/different idea on what new equipment to get.  I am pausing for a bit until my mind has

a chance to absorb this tremendous amount of information, and what options are better suited for me.

Problem with getting a pot to do 4 gallons is how to then get it into the LBK without spilling. So you either get a kettle with a valve, hose barb and some heat resistant tubing, or get a siphon set up going into the LBK. Lot of people siphon and brew suppliers carry them.

 

Lot of ways to skin the cat, and everybody has different needs and situations, so you design around what would suit you best. 

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I posted my way before, how I did 5 gallon batches.  

 

5 gallon pot ($16.99) at Adventures in Homebrewing.

5 gallon extract batches, which produce roughly 2.5 - 3 gallons of wort

1 gallon of cold water in each LBK

Cool wort to mid 90s.

Using a sanitized 1 quart measuring cup and a 2 cup measuring cup, scoop wort and pour through sanitized strainer into 1 quart cup.

Pour 1 quart cup into LBK 1.  

Repeat quart by quart, into each LBK, then top off with water.

 

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38 minutes ago, RickBeer said:

I posted my way before, how I did 5 gallon batches.  

 

5 gallon pot ($16.99) at Adventures in Homebrewing.

5 gallon extract batches, which produce roughly 2.5 - 3 gallons of wort

1 gallon of cold water in each LBK

Cool wort to mid 90s.

Using a sanitized 1 quart measuring cup and a 2 cup measuring cup, scoop wort and pour through sanitized strainer into 1 quart cup.

Pour 1 quart cup into LBK 1.  

Repeat quart by quart, into each LBK, then top off with water.

 

Another way to skin the cat, and inexpensive to boot. A 3 piece ball valve costs more than that 5 gal pot.

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13 hours ago, Creeps McLane said:

I dont get how a bigger fermenter will help you with your kettle issue. 

 

I take it you really want to go all grain?

 

This fermenter is cheaper

http://www.ritebrew.com/product-p/841242.htm

 

Before steeping up to 4 gallon batches, a bigger kettle will be needed.

There are cheaper fermenters, can do buckets if that's the only criteria, and may go that route.

Read many reviews and hours of videos, so far the catalyst is the winner, but that changes often.

All batches to date are either barely ok or "glad that was the last bottle".

Stopped brewing any new batches until current brews are sampled, 2 zombies clones and 1 dead ringer.

May do one more batch using nottingham yeast, and use zombie clone/dead ringer recipe. Slowing down and reviewing on what

I'm doing to prevent a pipeline of stuff.  If everything tasted so far was it, would stop right now.

Current 3 batches use DME and hop schedules, which need to be tasted before continuing with this method, or try all grain.

Pausing doing larger batches for now until "Wish I had more of that" happens.  Short term goals, brew good/great beer.

Long term goals, what will be needed to brew good/great beer on a larger scale.

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2 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

 

 

Stopped brewing any new batches until current brews are sampled, 2 zombies clones and 1 dead ringer.

 

how long till you sample? i always try one at 3 weeks and see if it's carbed enough.

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2 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

 

Before steeping up to 4 gallon batches, a bigger kettle will be needed.

There are cheaper fermenters, can do buckets if that's the only criteria, and may go that route.

Read many reviews and hours of videos, so far the catalyst is the winner, but that changes often.

All batches to date are either barely ok or "glad that was the last bottle".

Stopped brewing any new batches until current brews are sampled, 2 zombies clones and 1 dead ringer.

May do one more batch using nottingham yeast, and use zombie clone/dead ringer recipe. Slowing down and reviewing on what

I'm doing, and tastes are being sought to prevent a pipeline of stuff.  If everything tasted so far was it, would stop right now.

Current 3 batches use DME and hop schedules, which need to be tasted before continuing with this method, or try all grain.

Pausing doing larger batches for now until "Wish I had more of that" happens.  Short term goals, brew good/great beer.

Long term goals, what will be needed to make good/great beer on a larger scale.

This is stainless steel and easy to clean and maintain produces clean beer with very little sediment.

https://www.ssbrewtech.com/pages/brew-bucket

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55 minutes ago, Jdub said:

how long till you sample? i always try one at 3 weeks and see if it's carbed enough.

Sticking to the 3 ferment 4 condition, in about a week first sample.

 

22 minutes ago, Cato said:

This is stainless steel and easy to clean and maintain produces clean beer with very little sediment.

https://www.ssbrewtech.com/pages/brew-bucket

Thanks will review

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1 minute ago, Fire Rooster said:

Sticking to the 3 ferment 4 condition, in about a week first sample.

 

you have more discipline than i do. i can't wait that long. LOL. although this time of year for me it's challenging to find the right temp in the house for carbing.

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3 hours ago, Jdub said:

you have more discipline than i do. i can't wait that long. LOL. although this time of year for me it's challenging to find the right temp in the house for carbing.

Since basement is cold,  a very large cooler, ink bird, & seedling mat are used to carb/condition.  The recipe you gave me Zombie clone is in the cooler.

Carb-Cond.jpg

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18 hours ago, Creeps McLane said:

I dont get how a bigger fermenter will help you with your kettle issue. 

 

I take it you really want to go all grain?

 

This fermenter is cheaper

http://www.ritebrew.com/product-p/841242.htm

Sharing information from my research.

The catalyst is made out of Tritan.

https://www.tritanfromeastman.com/

 

The Catalyst’s tank is made from Tritan®, a medical-grade, BPA-free, polymer. This food-safe polymer is the highest quality material ever used in a fermenter, providing the clarity of glass with the durability and convenience of plastic. This material acts as an excellent barrier against oxygen, makes our tank 93% more scratch-resistant than other plastic fermenters and is even dishwasher safe, withstanding temperatures of up to 230º Fahrenheit.

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6 hours ago, Cato said:

This is stainless steel and easy to clean and maintain produces clean beer with very little sediment.

https://www.ssbrewtech.com/pages/brew-bucket

 

Never knew this.

http://beersmith.com/blog/2017/01/09/passivating-stainless-steel-beer-brewing-equipment-to-prevent-corrosion/

 

Read some had metallic taste until passivated.

 

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I divvy up the wort between LBKs with a sanitized ladle out of the saucepan. 4 scoops at a time until I get close to the end.

As said, many ways to skin the cat.

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2 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

Sharing information from my research.

The catalyst is made out of Tritan.

https://www.tritanfromeastman.com/

 

The Catalyst’s tank is made from Tritan®, a medical-grade, BPA-free, polymer. This food-safe polymer is the highest quality material ever used in a fermenter, providing the clarity of glass with the durability and convenience of plastic. This material acts as an excellent barrier against oxygen, makes our tank 93% more scratch-resistant than other plastic fermenters and is even dishwasher safe, withstanding temperatures of up to 230º Fahrenheit.

I am not sure it would fit in my dishwasher.

 

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2 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

 

Never knew this.

http://beersmith.com/blog/2017/01/09/passivating-stainless-steel-beer-brewing-equipment-to-prevent-corrosion/

 

Read some had metallic taste until passivated.

 

Yep, got to get off the machine oils with TSP and then run Star San through them. I run a batch of Star San through my kettle, ss fermenter,  and finally into a bucket with my IC, every batch. I'll use the MRB brand when I use an LBK, cause I have a backlog of packets.

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23 hours ago, Fire Rooster said:

Might be worth considering getting a good 7.5 or 8 gallon kettle with ball valve first, with option for a false bottom first.

With some tubing and hose barb, you could easily split between two LBK's without having to mess with ladles. 

Also consider getting some temp control for that cool basement. Easily done with an ink bird and a 35w fermentation heater.

 

Kettle would allow extract, extract PM's, and BIAB AG.

 

Fermentation heater and inkbird you could dial in precise temps for different yeasts. "Control your yeast and you control your beer".

 

Just a thought and my lowly two cents.

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49 minutes ago, Fire Rooster said:

 

Do you have this brew bucket ?

If so, how long have you had it ?

Any regrets ?

Improvements ?

Positives ? Negatives ?

 

Thanks

Yes, I have two, the 3.5 gal and the 7 gal. I bought the mini first last summer and brewed 2.5 to 3 gal batches, and love it. It's size fits in my mini fridge along with an LBK, so that's nice. It produces clearer beer to me, with less trub in the bottles than the LBK. 

The 7 gal I got a few months later and can use for 4-6 gal batches.

Only improvements I made was to install the beveled LBK washer in place  of the OEM o ring. Fits perfectly and makes rotating the racking arm a bit easier IMO. 

Very simple but effective design and widely used. Both sizes have options for heating and chilling system.

For a small batch brewer, I think they're ideal.

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